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Original: 11/29/2011 10:35 PM
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Tuesday, November 29, 2011

BF3

 

Guns. Explanation for the contents. Now with Back to Karkand.

Be sure to check the Message Board for information others have gathered from the data already.
Check out the data yourself with Frankelstner's extraction script.

WEAPON
The gun's there, obviously. Little symbol and word to show what class the weapon belongs to.
An indicator as to which fire modes the weapon has, Auto, Burst, single.

DAMAGE
Two damage numbers and the drop off points indicated by the red lines.
It is important to note here that the kind of ammo a weapon uses is taken into account.
The bullet itself determines the damage and range, the weapon just shoots them, which is why most weapons have the same damage.
Bullets have varying SPEED and DROP values.

For damage multipliers, all weapons deliver:
2.0x to the Head
1.0x to the Body
0.9x to the Legs

AMMO
CAPACITY is pretty straightforward. The magazine plus one in the chamber if it works that way.
The RATE OF FIRE in rounds per minute.
Bolt action rifles and the 870MCS show the time to rechamber the weapon.
The AN-94 is unique in that its BURST RATE OF FIRE differs from it's fully automatic rate of fire.

RELOAD time when the weapon is partially full.
RELOAD EMPTY time when the weapon has been... emptied.
1stRELOAD for shotguns that reload one at a time.
NEXT REL. for all shotguns rounds after the first.

SPREAD
Weapons have an inherit inaccuracy when sighted.
For example the AK-74M has a 0.2 cone of fire when zoomed and standing still.

BASE Spread when standing still.
ZOOM Spread when sighted and still.
ZOOM MOVE Spread when sighted and moving.
Spread added PER SHOT, and the Spread RECOVERY per second.

NOTE: The behavior of Spread is more like Battlefield 2 than Bad Company 2.
The very low increase per shot and the high decrease per second may seem odd, but that is because the weapon does not gradually recover while you are firing, only after you have released the trigger.
The patch released alongside Back to Karkand has doubled the increase per shot for nearly every weapon, making them unreliably inaccurate far more quickly.

SHOTGUNS have an inherit spread for Buckshot and Flechette.
The 870MCS only has a 2.0 cone of fire while the automatics have 4.0.
SLUG, SLUGZ and ZMOVE for their spread when using Slug or Frag rounds.

RECOIL
A fixed upwards number.
Two left-right numbers which make the area the weapon will randomly kick in.
A rapid recovery rate per second.

The FIRST SHOT taken with a weapon at rest has its recoil multiplied.
In nearly every weapon, the recoil is higher.
The AN-94 is unique in that its first shot recoils less, making its two round burst especially effective.

SHOTGUNS

Take note that the damage column along the shotguns are for the types of shot and not just to that particular shotgun.
Buckshot, Flechette, Frag, Slug for automatics and Slug for the 870MCS.

The FRAG shotgun round not only delivers impact damage, but has a small explosive blast of 40 damage over a 3 meter radius.
A point blank shot is capable of a one hit kill.

 Posted 11/29/2011 10:35 PM - 428276 Views - 80 eProps - 56 comments

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Visit DeadlyFungi's Xanga Site!

This excites me.

Posted 11/21/2011 2:11 PM by DeadlyFungi - recommend (1) - reply

Visit Omen86's Xanga Site!

Keep up the good work, if this is anything like your previous charts then I don't see why anyone would look at any other data besides your stuff.
If there is anything a gamer (non programmer) can do to help, just say.

Posted 11/21/2011 8:57 PM by Omen86 - recommend - reply

Visit seud's Xanga Site!

Yeah. Hope this will be soon online, and we'll even have patched numbers !
We'll eventually be able to say this gun is OP or UP.

Posted 11/22/2011 11:39 AM by seud - recommend - reply

Visit Jaedongz's Xanga Site!

Is the m60 damage a mistake?

Posted 11/22/2011 12:58 PM by Jaedongz - recommend - reply

Visit plokool's Xanga Site!
Awesome, thanks Den for getting onto this! You always do the best charts. So is this going to be a flash based chart or a simple jpeg? Personally I like the jpeg as you can see more information at a glance without too much clicking.
Also, is it possible to add something like damage per second, shots to kill, or time to kill? Any/all of these would be incredibly useful imo.
Posted 11/22/2011 9:59 PM by plokool - recommend - reply

Visit forest_noir's Xanga Site!

Nice work!  By the way, why the spread value ignroe the prone and crouch stances? Do they make the chart too crowd?


Anyway, thank you!

Posted 11/22/2011 11:20 PM by forest_noir - recommend - reply

Visit megumino2's Xanga Site!

Regarding "add" under reloading

Since in BF3 we have both "tactical reload" and "reload.empty", is add time different for the two?
If it's the same, gun swapping (especially for RPGs and LMGs) will be even more important

I'd assume it's different though

Posted 11/23/2011 12:03 AM by megumino2 - recommend - reply

Visit DenKirson's Xanga Site!

@plokool - From now on, I'm sticking with images only. No more Flash.
Because of the inherit random spread of weapons, the long distance of combat and the necessary number of hits, a DPS or TTK isn't very useful as few shootouts would even come close to the ideal listed number.

@forest_noir - That is one reason. More than that, firing from the hip is usually a waste of ammo unless you are point blank (and after the first shot you aren't at the minimum spread anymore) so the numbers for those stances are not very useful.
The most important numbers are the ones when sighted.
The third reason is that just about every case, the three postures have a difference of 0.5 Minimum Spread for assault rifles and SMGs (as in 1.5, 2.0, 2.5), and a 1.0 difference for LMGs (as in 3.0, 4.0, 5.0).
Moving is a +0.5 to rifle and SMG spread, +1.0 for LMGs.

@megumino2 - I'm not sure, but that is probably the case. Reload Threshold is a percentage of the reload time and is the only variable. The AK-74M's Threshold is 0.8, 1.76 to its 2.2 ReloadTime.
If the ReloadThreshold is a percentage of both reload types, I may leave it at the percentage instead of putting the resulting time in there.

I left out a column for Mobility related variables since the currently converted text left stuff like zoom and weapon raise/drop times incomplete.

Posted 11/23/2011 2:20 AM by DenKirson - recommend - reply

Visit TheShatner's Xanga Site!

Perhaps the bullet velocity is the 'base' and then the weapons velocity is what it starts at when it leaves the gun; indicating that the velocity drops off over distance? I thought this because, according to Wikipedia (not the best source, but its just a ballpark) the AK-74M has a muzzle velocity of 900, and 350+600 is 950, which is close.

Posted 11/23/2011 6:00 AM by TheShatner - recommend - reply

Visit Hecter94's Xanga Site!

WOOOOOT!
Thank you Den, your awesome dude.

Posted 11/23/2011 3:29 PM by Hecter94 - recommend - reply

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Yes! Brilliant!

Posted 11/23/2011 5:30 PM by AceGreg - recommend - reply

Visit BottyholeGemmie's Xanga Site!

Damn, these next 4 days or so are gonna go slow, especially with a lot of other things going on besides good ol' Den getting the chart done. Still, can't wait. :) I'm hoping that chart in which all ARs at least did 25 max damage was inaccurate, since that seemed bullshitty.

Posted 11/24/2011 9:49 AM by BottyholeGemmie - recommend - reply

Visit DenKirson's Xanga Site!

@BottyholeGemmie - Considering nearly every AR uses 5.56 or 5.45, and both of those ammo types do 25 Max damage...

Posted 11/24/2011 10:21 AM by DenKirson - recommend - reply

Visit megumino2's Xanga Site!

Oh, right
By the way, Den, is it okay for me to translate and Photoshop your charts into other languages?
I will credit you and your site in the translations

Posted 11/25/2011 1:02 PM by megumino2 - recommend - reply

Visit fragerdaz's Xanga Site!

Still looking at 1-4 days? ;)

I'm sure a few thousand people are anxious to see these tables! :)

Posted 11/29/2011 8:57 AM by fragerdaz - recommend (1) - reply

Visit Vertigo345's Xanga Site!

dale cabron yo voya ti.....

Posted 11/29/2011 2:05 PM by Vertigo345 - recommend - reply

Visit Stonards's Xanga Site!

Just anxious? No, I've been constantly refreshing every day... lol

I have been using your graphs since 2007, and every time a new FPS comes out, I always check here. Keep up the great work, and thank you for putting your time and effort into something that helps out the FPS community so much.

Posted 11/29/2011 9:52 PM by Stonards - recommend - reply

Visit ohman1990's Xanga Site!

Hey Den! I loved your BFBC2 charts. That's why I kept checking your site every couple of hours for the past days.
But I have to admit that I am a little disappointed. These charts are very hard to read. I don't get that instant overview I had when I was looking at your old BFBC2 charts. And I have to search for some time, to find a specific value of a gun. Also it's much harder to compare the guns with each other.
I am a big fan of your work and used your BFBC2 charts a lot. I would love to see the same structure and organization in your new charts too. That would make them much more usable. :)
Keep it up!

Posted 11/30/2011 3:30 AM by ohman1990 - recommend - reply

Visit brambosss's Xanga Site!

very nice, used your page for bc2, and now I use this one, thanks a lot!

 I see 1 small mistake, as far as I know the g18 does not have 20 + 1 bullet capacity, but 19 + 1.

Posted 11/30/2011 9:20 AM by brambosss - recommend - reply

Visit Cleverbird's Xanga Site!

Awesome man, I've been eagerly awaiting this!


But is the drop-off point for the bolt-action snipers, most notably the M98B, correct? It seems odd that the semi-auto snipers apparently have a higher drop-off point.
Posted 11/30/2011 9:31 AM by Cleverbird - recommend - reply

Visit seud's Xanga Site!

Very Good Chart.
We can see that RU guns are a bit worse than their US counterparts. The only exception is the MP443, which has slower bullets but 2 rounds more in clip.

Still, I agree this chart needs more space, to "breathe".

One mistake or two also :

- Neither KH2002 nor M16A4 has an auto mode

- M26 MASS has an extra shell. It's 5+1.

Posted 11/30/2011 11:32 AM by seud - recommend - reply

Visit HiTechH8's Xanga Site!

Thank you for your hard work! I look forward to these charts at every release. Please add the TYPE 88 LMG for us PWP users. 

Posted 11/30/2011 3:33 PM by HiTechH8 - recommend - reply

Visit DenKirson's Xanga Site!

@megumino2 - Sure.

@brambosss - Got it.

@Cleverbird - The M98b was off, but the other rifles had accurate dropoffs. I've edited the M98 to its correct range, 20 - 77m.

@seud - Got em.

@ohman1990 - Yes. All previous charts had a lot of empty space, and they were all so wide. I've always been trying to make the things as small as possible to minimize scrolling around.

One big issue that led to lots of up-down scrolling was in having no direct indicator as to what the numbers meant since the only descriptor was at the top of the column (which was why I then edited BC2 chart to have the header separate each class).
The other resolution that made things easier was in having a slightly more descriptive word right next to each number.
As well, I'd settled on spacing everything in tens. Each border is some multiple of ten.
A 5x7 pixel monospaced "CG Mono" font with a 10 pixel line space, the absolute smallest font that still has each character clearly visible.
I wanted to make a uniform chart that could be used for all future games, but that is virtually impossible since each game handles their objects differently.

Being packed together so tightly does make skimming difficult, how about putting some space between the lines and text?

Posted 11/30/2011 3:34 PM by DenKirson - recommend - reply

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@HiTechH8 - I was going to wait for Karkand to be released since the Type88 is technically a part of that for everyone who didn't get the Type88 pre-order bonus. I'll get it in there soon.

In the meantime, the Type 88 has:
25-17 damage
600 bullet speed
650 rate of fire
0.6 spread like most LMGs
7.2 reload time
0.5 Up Recoil, 0.4-0.4 Side Recoil, 1.34 First Shot and 1.5 recovery.

Posted 11/30/2011 3:41 PM by DenKirson - recommend - reply

Visit ohman1990's Xanga Site!

@DenKirson - Alright then.
The spaces between lines and text make it a little better. :)

Posted 11/30/2011 4:57 PM by ohman1990 - recommend - reply

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